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	<title>Comments on: ATEK on the English Teachers and the Swine Flu</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/</link>
	<description>News and views about Korean society and culture.</description>
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		<title>By: 3gyupsal</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4726</link>
		<dc:creator>3gyupsal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 15:10:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4726</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d kind of like to be quarantined.   Back home, June means the beginning of summer break.  Here, June means hot weather and hot tempers, kids falling asleep in class, and Korean teachers beating the shit out of them with a bamboo pole.   If I wasn&#039;t trying to loose some weight I&#039;d consider a one night bender on 3gyupsal and soju in order to fake some symptoms of swine flu, just to get the seven day quarantine vacation.  

Btw, I&#039;m just kidding, I don&#039;t want to be quarantined in Seoul while crazy midget with girl glasses is  playing the nuclear &quot;Notice me, notice me,&quot; game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d kind of like to be quarantined.   Back home, June means the beginning of summer break.  Here, June means hot weather and hot tempers, kids falling asleep in class, and Korean teachers beating the shit out of them with a bamboo pole.   If I wasn&#8217;t trying to loose some weight I&#8217;d consider a one night bender on 3gyupsal and soju in order to fake some symptoms of swine flu, just to get the seven day quarantine vacation.  </p>
<p>Btw, I&#8217;m just kidding, I don&#8217;t want to be quarantined in Seoul while crazy midget with girl glasses is  playing the nuclear &#8220;Notice me, notice me,&#8221; game.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4718</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 11:39:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4718</guid>
		<description>The quarantine is for Koreans and Foreigners alike. It is a Public Health issue, not a labor issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The quarantine is for Koreans and Foreigners alike. It is a Public Health issue, not a labor issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Fan Death Avenger</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4712</link>
		<dc:creator>Fan Death Avenger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 09:13:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4712</guid>
		<description>Why focus on the English teachers? KOREANS have been quarantined, too, you know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why focus on the English teachers? KOREANS have been quarantined, too, you know.</p>
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		<title>By: WonderGirl</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4701</link>
		<dc:creator>WonderGirl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 03:29:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4701</guid>
		<description>I would definitely want an English teacher who may have swine flu to be quarantined. Children are especially susceptible to swine flu. It&#039;s worth the risk of  inconveniencing  an English teacher if a child&#039;s life is at stake.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would definitely want an English teacher who may have swine flu to be quarantined. Children are especially susceptible to swine flu. It&#8217;s worth the risk of  inconveniencing  an English teacher if a child&#8217;s life is at stake.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4696</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 23:25:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4696</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;If you are my boss and you tell me not to leave my apartment except to teach, THAT’S discrimination. 

&gt;No it’s not. It’s idiotic.

Yes, it is. You say that as if the two things are mutually exclusive!

&gt;And its an idiocy based on ignorance of viral epidemiology and disease prevention.

I completely agree! And that ignorance of viral epidemiology and disease prevention (prophylaxis) has a disparate impact on people from seven countries. That&#039;s discrimination.

&gt;Not on race.

Disparate impact on a particular group of people is &lt;i&gt;de facto&lt;/i&gt; discrimination against that group regardless of intent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;If you are my boss and you tell me not to leave my apartment except to teach, THAT’S discrimination. </p>
<p>&gt;No it’s not. It’s idiotic.</p>
<p>Yes, it is. You say that as if the two things are mutually exclusive!</p>
<p>&gt;And its an idiocy based on ignorance of viral epidemiology and disease prevention.</p>
<p>I completely agree! And that ignorance of viral epidemiology and disease prevention (prophylaxis) has a disparate impact on people from seven countries. That&#8217;s discrimination.</p>
<p>&gt;Not on race.</p>
<p>Disparate impact on a particular group of people is <i>de facto</i> discrimination against that group regardless of intent.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Yates</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4693</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Yates</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 17:06:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4693</guid>
		<description>Stafford, ATEK are an organisation formed by human rights activists, who launched a human rights campaign off the back of a report to the National Human Rights Commission of Korea that was submitted by a human rights lawyer. What are these pesky teachers you speak of?

ATEK are monitoring the government? Laughable!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stafford, ATEK are an organisation formed by human rights activists, who launched a human rights campaign off the back of a report to the National Human Rights Commission of Korea that was submitted by a human rights lawyer. What are these pesky teachers you speak of?</p>
<p>ATEK are monitoring the government? Laughable!</p>
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		<title>By: Stafford</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4691</link>
		<dc:creator>Stafford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 15:17:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4691</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;If you are my boss and you tell me not to leave my apartment except to teach, THAT’S discrimination. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

No it&#039;s not. It&#039;s idiotic.

And its an idiocy based on ignorance of viral epidemiology and disease prevention. Not on race.

In addition it&#039;s based on what I have also said is anecdotally plausible. (albeit a bit panic-ridden). I cannot cite any studies (and I would say they don&#039;t exist) but this week I have spent more time in close contact with other Foreign teachers than I have on the Subway. If one of those teachers had the flu wouldn&#039;t the exposure to them vis-a-vis time spent in the subway put more more at risk of catching something?

Either way this is not really the point I was originally trying to make, I ain&#039;t a doctor and your point makes just as much sense.

Rather my gripe is with the type of language ATEK is using in addressing the issue, which at best seems unnecessarily heavy handed and at worst, is little more than alarmist media whoring.

Might I suggest ATEK&#039;s time might be better spent, it&#039;s membership better served, and it&#039;s detractors silenced, if it were to concentrate on matters related to Employment and Immigration, rather than matters of Public Health.

For me personally, that would be something to do with Visa Portability which &lt;i&gt;is&lt;/i&gt; discriminatory and in its present state constitutes little more than indentured servitude.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>If you are my boss and you tell me not to leave my apartment except to teach, THAT’S discrimination. </p></blockquote>
<p>No it&#8217;s not. It&#8217;s idiotic.</p>
<p>And its an idiocy based on ignorance of viral epidemiology and disease prevention. Not on race.</p>
<p>In addition it&#8217;s based on what I have also said is anecdotally plausible. (albeit a bit panic-ridden). I cannot cite any studies (and I would say they don&#8217;t exist) but this week I have spent more time in close contact with other Foreign teachers than I have on the Subway. If one of those teachers had the flu wouldn&#8217;t the exposure to them vis-a-vis time spent in the subway put more more at risk of catching something?</p>
<p>Either way this is not really the point I was originally trying to make, I ain&#8217;t a doctor and your point makes just as much sense.</p>
<p>Rather my gripe is with the type of language ATEK is using in addressing the issue, which at best seems unnecessarily heavy handed and at worst, is little more than alarmist media whoring.</p>
<p>Might I suggest ATEK&#8217;s time might be better spent, it&#8217;s membership better served, and it&#8217;s detractors silenced, if it were to concentrate on matters related to Employment and Immigration, rather than matters of Public Health.</p>
<p>For me personally, that would be something to do with Visa Portability which <i>is</i> discriminatory and in its present state constitutes little more than indentured servitude.</p>
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		<title>By: pocariboy73</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4689</link>
		<dc:creator>pocariboy73</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 12:13:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4689</guid>
		<description>My boss told me that Koreans are less likely to catch the virus due to their high intake of Kimchi. Thus, I would have to say foreigners are more likey to catch the virus than Koreans.

Kimchi also prevented the SARS virus from spreading in Korea. And, Kimchi is one of the top ten most nutitional foods in the World. 

But Chinese Kimchi is dirty. It has many small bugs and they use paint to give it the red colour. 

Korean Kimchi #1. 
Chinese Kimchi #678</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My boss told me that Koreans are less likely to catch the virus due to their high intake of Kimchi. Thus, I would have to say foreigners are more likey to catch the virus than Koreans.</p>
<p>Kimchi also prevented the SARS virus from spreading in Korea. And, Kimchi is one of the top ten most nutitional foods in the World. </p>
<p>But Chinese Kimchi is dirty. It has many small bugs and they use paint to give it the red colour. </p>
<p>Korean Kimchi #1.<br />
Chinese Kimchi #678</p>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4687</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 11:48:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4687</guid>
		<description>If you are my boss and you tell me not to leave my apartment except to teach, THAT&#039;S discrimination. And that&#039;s the kind of discrimination I&#039;m talking about. Foreigners are NOT more likely to pass the virus than Koreans, and I can demonstrate it right here:

Infected foreigner lands a job. Gets on an airplane bound for Incheon. How many Koreans on that flight? More than half? That&#039;s right. Anyway, moving on. He lands. Talks with a Korean immigration official. Maybe a Korean customs official. Gets met by his Korean handler. Gets in a vehicle of some sort, and is taken to his new apartment. In Seoul or other big cities, he rides the subway with between 5 and 50 Koreans in the car. Anyway, he gets there. Teaches the next day. Goes to his place of employment. meets the 80% to 95% Korean staff. Then meets his Korean students.

How many Koreans and how many foreigners can he have infected by the time he starts his job? I think it would be more advisable to tell foreigners not to congregate with KOREANS to avoid catching it.*

* &lt;i&gt;I don&#039;t actually think that would be advisable.&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you are my boss and you tell me not to leave my apartment except to teach, THAT&#8217;S discrimination. And that&#8217;s the kind of discrimination I&#8217;m talking about. Foreigners are NOT more likely to pass the virus than Koreans, and I can demonstrate it right here:</p>
<p>Infected foreigner lands a job. Gets on an airplane bound for Incheon. How many Koreans on that flight? More than half? That&#8217;s right. Anyway, moving on. He lands. Talks with a Korean immigration official. Maybe a Korean customs official. Gets met by his Korean handler. Gets in a vehicle of some sort, and is taken to his new apartment. In Seoul or other big cities, he rides the subway with between 5 and 50 Koreans in the car. Anyway, he gets there. Teaches the next day. Goes to his place of employment. meets the 80% to 95% Korean staff. Then meets his Korean students.</p>
<p>How many Koreans and how many foreigners can he have infected by the time he starts his job? I think it would be more advisable to tell foreigners not to congregate with KOREANS to avoid catching it.*</p>
<p>* <i>I don&#8217;t actually think that would be advisable.</i></p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://www.koreasparkle.com/2009/05/atek-on-the-english-teachers-and-the-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-4686</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 09:12:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.koreasparkle.com/?p=1953#comment-4686</guid>
		<description>First of all, there&#039;s kind of the assumption that all foreigners know each other, and are likely to have interacted with the infected.  Why not call in all the Koreans from Mapo-gu for blood tests, then, because they&#039;re more likely to have met these guys than a teacher down in Mokpo (who was asked about her plans and whereabouts, as if she could have left the country in the past few months without nobody knowing).

But, yeah, at a time like this it doesn&#039;t play well for ATEK to come across so accusatory in the first paragraph.  Especially when there&#039;s really nothing ATEK can do.  I mean, all due respect, what are you going to do to the authorities?  And who is anyone other than healthcare professionals to lecture about the quality or consistency of care?  The most important tool here is information.  Do what Professor Wagner did and go up there and talk to people, find out what&#039;s happening, find out if there&#039;s any funny business.  While I&#039;ve said many times that I think it&#039;s ridiculous to think that foreign teachers in general are a threat, it&#039;s not irrational to worry about &lt;em&gt;these&lt;/em&gt; teachers because, after all, they have swine flu.  It&#039;s not a made up worry.  But I don&#039;t think we need to start off saying Koreans are discriminating against foreigners.  Not yet anyway, and not, it appears, inside the quarantine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First of all, there&#8217;s kind of the assumption that all foreigners know each other, and are likely to have interacted with the infected.  Why not call in all the Koreans from Mapo-gu for blood tests, then, because they&#8217;re more likely to have met these guys than a teacher down in Mokpo (who was asked about her plans and whereabouts, as if she could have left the country in the past few months without nobody knowing).</p>
<p>But, yeah, at a time like this it doesn&#8217;t play well for ATEK to come across so accusatory in the first paragraph.  Especially when there&#8217;s really nothing ATEK can do.  I mean, all due respect, what are you going to do to the authorities?  And who is anyone other than healthcare professionals to lecture about the quality or consistency of care?  The most important tool here is information.  Do what Professor Wagner did and go up there and talk to people, find out what&#8217;s happening, find out if there&#8217;s any funny business.  While I&#8217;ve said many times that I think it&#8217;s ridiculous to think that foreign teachers in general are a threat, it&#8217;s not irrational to worry about <em>these</em> teachers because, after all, they have swine flu.  It&#8217;s not a made up worry.  But I don&#8217;t think we need to start off saying Koreans are discriminating against foreigners.  Not yet anyway, and not, it appears, inside the quarantine.</p>
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